Screens on Schuco Sliders

[2_Many_Questions]

First, let me thank the many people on this message board for your views and input.

I spent 3-4 months researching windows (it's a big investment, and I'm an engineer...) and found this to be the most useful source of information (adding in the nfrc and bbb for some hard numbers). After hearing such praise for Schuco windows as I did on this board, I intentionally searched out a local company to give me a quote. Their quote was good (again, armed with info from this board I knew what to negotiate to) and we made a deal. My windows were installed a little over a week ago, and I've now had some time to look them over.

Now, some questions and comments...

Overall, looks like a very good design (again, I'm an engineer... I appreciate those things). I am a little concerned with some of the "craftmanship" issues, as there were poorly aligned seems, some "extra" material removed to make the windows slide, and in one case several extra holes where someone tried to make a lock work that wouldn't (that whole window is being replaced as the installers couldn't make it work either). Overall, the fit and finish weren't quite up to a lot of the reviews I've seen on here, but quite frankly I'm sure I'm looking harder at them now than I will 1 month from now, 1 year from now, etc. If they work well, open and close smoothly, and perform well in insulating and lighting over time I will be more than happy. I do have one question that really does concern me, however...

Can you get a full screen on a Schuco Inline Slider?

I was told by the company several times that's what was ordered and what I was getting, however that is not what came in. The windows were installed, and I was assured that I would get the correct screens later and they would be put in. I am now, however, being told that you cannot get full screens on an Inline slider. If not, then aside from cleaning, what good is being able to swing the windows in (like french doors)?

Could someone who KNOWS please let me know if it is possible to get full screens and the installation company just isn't pushing the issue, or if I was misinformed by them from the beginning? Thanks.

[FenEx]

Problems with making the In-line slider "slide and lock" better, are almost always attributed to installation. The answer to your other question is, NO, they are not available with full screens. Does your contract say full screens on the Inline slider? This is not a window to be installed by a handyman or amateur. The unit is not designed to have both sashes left open, only for short periods of time for cleaning. It appears you had poor communication or a poor presentation.

[Window4U (IL)]

If you wanted them to remain open, they should have shown you the tilt-n-turn French Swing window.
As FenEx said, the sliders only swing in for cleaning purposes, not for ventilation.

[2_Many_Questions]

Thanks for the responses.

I will have to re-read the contract regarding the screens. It will be a shame if it comes down to something like that, as I have had at least 4 conversations with different individuals before the installation: first the salesman, then an administrative assistant (she read it from some paperwork she had), then the service manager (again reading it from an order), and finally the lead installer (claiming he noticed it during the trip over to install).

Seems like overall (as you said Window4U) I should have been led towards the French Swing style (as I was told by several companies that my windows, being wider than tall, were not suited well for double hung).

As far as the installation company, I was told they were a "certified" (okay, not sure if I'm using the right term) installer by Schuco. The installation crew was supposed to have gone through extra training with Schuco directly. I'm not sure if it matters for anything at this point, but they were the Suprema Plus version (I may have read too much into that association).

[2_Many_Questions]

Schuco's own website doesn't help explain the use of the swing in feature as cleaning only either...

"Enjoy a great new view with the beauty of a traditional slider but the function of a wonderful French casement. Its European design allows you to open your view and enjoy the beautiful outdoors."

(Sorry if it feels like I'm venting, but I truly thought I had done my homework up front...)

[FenEx]

"As far as the installation company, I was told they were a "certified" (okay, not sure if I'm using the right term) installer by Schuco. The installation crew was supposed to have gone through extra training with Schuco directly. I'm not sure if it matters for anything at this point, but they were the Suprema Plus version (I may have read too much into that association)."

Sir.... I'm sorry you are having problems. I for one fight for certifications which some mean something, and others mean nothing. MOST have NO teeth, even some of those most prominently displayed by contractors and builders. I got a stack of em'... some just to see if I could without even giving the information they asked for. I got em' all.. each and every one... some just for responding. The "Suprema Plus" version is simply a different name for the same window (Schuco Corona) with a different internal glazing bead (concave instead of convex) that was issued to a company in NJ. They have put together a band of dealers under the Suprema line to differentiate.

When people seek a licensed contractor or builder... they assume it means a professional. I ask every homeowner reading this to check the internet for their city or one near them.... and apply for a builders/remodelers license. I'll damn near guaranty they are approved as soon as their CC or check clears. Why?? Because the building officials and code enforcement employees aren't required to be properly trained either. My ex-roomate Freshman year in college is the Head Building Inspector of a local city here in IL.... he was tossed out his first year for a beer-induced GPA of less than 1.0. As for manufacturer certifications, my pregnant wife has several already, including framed, just because her name hit the company list. For instance, she is a Certified Simonton window installer, certificate and all. Next week, I'll show her what a screwdriver is.

People... we can only teach you so much. Common sense must apply when dealing with others. 2_Many... your dealer was either misinformed.. or they lied to get the sale. This is niether the fault of Schuco or others that sell the product.... just the dealer you selected.

[2_Many_Questions]

FenEx, by no means am I trying to imply that you, Schuco, or any other particular installers are shady in their dealings (though I am sure that there are many out there). I'm simply trying to get information on something that was apparently not conveyed properly to me before.

As for the common sense comment, I'm not quite sure where that one is coming from... I am not trying to question your intelligence, or integrity, so please don't do that with me. You are obviously in the Replacement Window business, so what is "Common Sense" to you may not be to someone who is purchasing windows for the first time. Yes, I did my homework. Yes, I asked the right questions. Yes, I checked the Better Business Bureau. Yes, I checked Schuco's website. Yes, I checked this message board. Yes, I checked any other postings I could find on the web. Yes, I brought several people in before deciding upon a type/manufacturer of window to purchase. People can only make judgements based on the information that they are given. As I said before, I didn't make a rash decision... I spent a lot of time in research. Unfortunately, other than the nfrc, I was never able to find a truly non-biased rating on replacement windows.

Now, having said all that... I'm still not unhappy with the windows or the installation. The fact that I won't be able to use my windows completely as originally planned bothers me. I don't know whether that was due to someone not knowing the product well enough, or simply as you suggested them trying to make a sale.

Since I was there during the installation, I do know that the one window that is being replaced had extra screw holes in it when it arrived at my house. That's not to say that someone at the installers sight didn't do it before sending it out to my home (though the windows were still wrapped and banded) for some reason. All I know is that it doesn't work properly, and it is being replaced. I am fine with that.

Unfortunately for me, I didn't go to school with the people that installed/sold my windows so I don't have that extra bit of insight into their character.

[Window4U (IL)]

As for manufacturer certifications, my pregnant wife has several already, including framed, just because her name hit the company list. For instance, she is a Certified Simonton window installer, certificate and all. Next week, I'll show her what a screwdriver is.

Tonya is going to kick your butt ........as soon as she gets out of labor.