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 Post subject: Ubelievably Biased Website Discussion Board
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 1:59 am 

Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2005 1:36 am
Posts: 2
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We have been observing this site for some time. Unlike other sites such as Bob Vila.com, this site's goal is to be as bias as possible to promote vinyl windows. We find it interesting that previous posts supporting non-vinyl windows or criticizing false and misleading information have been systematically purged so no one can read it. Such is the case with positive discussion of Renewal by Andersen. Obviously, Renewal must be having a significant impact on the vinyl guys business. Otherwise, why do they have to make up lies and misinformation? In addition, there are only a few people, (those selling vinyl), that continually dominate the discussion in this site. In the larger window replacement universe, this site offers very little real truth to the consumer. Vinyl guys... ask yourselves why Pella, Marvin, AMSCO, Milgard and others are making big moves to compsites. If vinyl is final, why? And then ask yourselves why every day window companies are pounding on Andersen's door to get into the Renewal program? It could be that last year alone Renewal did over $310 million of installed business and Andesen over $2.3 billion. Hmmmm


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 8:14 am 

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:10 pm
Posts: 225
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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Goodshep, Your points are very well presented in your opposition to the vinyl window sellers. Although I feel your criticism of this site and the Pro's on it are very wrong. If you have been following this board for the past couple months you would know better. I myself personally have been promoting Pella in numerous threads. I've even flat out told everyone I would fight them until I die! I know the boys down in Texas have pushed the Eagle line of windows along with Marvin. I've even argued with Randy about some issues pertaining to Pella. I know W4U and Fenex have both pushed the Marvin product consistantly.

If you've been following this sight you would have noticed one thing about all the different Andersen posts. It's the supporters of the RBA product coming onto this sight and promoting their stance with flat out bold faced lies. Example: Andersen invented the term LoE for glass. So when someone comes on here and pitches the product in a false manner you bet Fireworks will be coming over the horizon! The one thing you have to remember is we are here for free and the love of the industry. We offer our time at no charge and don't pitch our companies to make a dime. If I ever see a post from MN I never attack it with a sales pitch or even contact them to give a bid. I answer all questions as if they were in a different universe.

Our beliefs here are a collaboration of dedicated years in the industry. Between FeneX, Window4U and myself we have 30 years each of knowledge in the industry. Combined that is almost a decade of service to the industry. What we believe in is serving the industry in an honest and truthful way. There is NO honor left in the world today. The customer today has so many things to worry about when buying anything. Who's going to try and rip me off today or sell me a bunch of junk. The average customer has to answer these questions daily. With todays communications and internet availability. The average customer now has the methods and abilities to search out information and opinions from all across the world. So Texas can see what we do here in Minnesota or New York checking on California. So now the average Joe can sit at their desk and over consume knowledge.

What everyone coming to this sight needs to understand is we are offering years of opinion derived from actually using these products. I myself never comment on anything I've never used or seen. I only comment on the products I know. Coming from MN though I have an advantage. Most of the biggest players in the industry are from here. So I get a first hand look at almost all of it. My main level of play on this board is the installation process of the product. I'm an installer!! Not a salesman (although I do have to sell to make some money to eat) or henchman for Schuco, Marvin or Pella. I pitch and sell Pella because I believe in it's product. But I push the product with real hard facts and no fabricated lies. I push the Schuco line because I think it's the best...hell I can't even sell the product to the end user! My territory here in MN is already taken. So I have nothing to gain by pushing it. I guess the bottom line is. Do you the customer want to invest your hard earned dollar from a person who was trained by being told what to say from a book or manager. Or do you want to believe the guy who's hung so many doors and windows over the last 30 years both his Rotator Cuff's are torn almost beyond use! I'll take the guy who's been out in the trenches physically using it everyday!!!!!!

So in a couple weeks when you don't see me around here for awhile. I'll be in a sling getting the right side repaired so I'm good for 30 more years!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Ubelievably Biased Website Discussion Board
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:47 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:58 pm
Posts: 1333
Location: Northern & Central Illinois, Chicago suburbs
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GOODSHEP wrote:
We have been observing this site for some time. Unlike other sites such as Bob Vila.com, this site's goal is to be as bias as possible to promote vinyl windows.


Hey Goodshep, do me a favor and look up at the name of this site. Like my daughter used to say........... duhhh!

Maybe you should start up your own forum about grossly overpriced windows made from sawdust. I'm sure the domain name "Sawdust-replacement-windows.com"is not taken.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 10:14 am 

Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2005 12:57 am
Posts: 135
Location: ne ohio
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W4U
went to the website you suggested and all it said was "you will believe everything we say, you will believe everything we say, now get out your checkbook"


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 10:26 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:58 pm
Posts: 1333
Location: Northern & Central Illinois, Chicago suburbs
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LOL :P


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 Post subject: Old Discussion Board
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 11:20 am 
Site Admin

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 9:11 am
Posts: 96
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If anyone would like to read posts from our old board they are still readily available for viewing. Here is the link to the archived old board;

http://vinyl-replacement-windows.com/re ... st.php?f=1

In follow up to the original post of this thread if you’re looking for discussion on Andersen Renewal you can go to the old board and use the search function.

We would also like to ask that when you register please fill in as much information as you can about your self for the "profile". This lets readers of the board get some sense of who are responding, or posting and their qualifications as such. We would hope for registers to at least enter their e-mail address, this way we can provide personalized responses to any concerns.

We are very proud of the old board which has thousands of posts from consumers and professionals alike. We hope this board will be as successful.

VRW Admin


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 Post subject: reply
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 12:11 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:43 pm
Posts: 353
Location: Illinois
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How dare people primarily talk about vinyl replacement windows on a site called, "Vinyl-Replacement-Windows.com". The Nerve!!! What were we thinking?

The latest Ducker Research annual study in this month's DWM shows the North American window market as: 47% Vinyl, 40% Wood, 11% Aluminum and 2% Other (including fiberglass and composites). Therefore, I think it's only fair that we include the "Other" in our discussions 2% of the time. OK... we have already hit the quota for the month. Bob Villa's site is paid for entirely by advertising sponsors... not biased? I think what's upsetting you is that Andersen can't buy this site like the others. Here, we put product against product and compare their features and performance instead of their advertising campaigns. Please share the features and performance of your products and why they are better. Ironically, you left those details out and went right back to name recogniton (advertising) based sales.

A company I work with on the East Coast was just approached by Renewal, not the other way around. We got the whole presentation... and are declining due to lack of interest in the product compared to the lines already represented. They wanted more money, for much less window, an agreement to terminate all other product sales, and a mega-committment to purchase advertising literature to further flood the market with name recognition based sales. Sound familiar?

FenEx


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 2:40 pm 
Site Admin

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 9:11 am
Posts: 96
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Goodshep,

This may be of interest to you;

We look for professionals from all manufacturers to participate on this board and others we administer. In fact about two years ago we were quite interested in the Fibrex product and in particular its development and introduction into the marketplace; so much so that we contacted Renewal by Andersen to express this and offered to create a new section on the site devoted to this product line. They sent us some informational sheets that we scanned and put up on the site. All of this material was put up exactly the way it was sent to us, complete with all logos, Renewal contact information, ect. Between this site and others of ours we attract over 1,000,000 unique visitors per year, (not hits but unique visitors).

As you can imagine that is a tremendous amount of exposure, and at the time we had the section devoted to Renewal we were basically parading 80,000 professionals and window shoppers by their product every month.

Well after about four months we were contacted by Renewal stating that they did not want their name, and material on the sites, and that we had to take it down immediately. They felt it was damaging to their brand name and were rather direct about removing it immediately. Safe to say we were a bit surprised at this, especially given that we were pretty convinced it had to be driving sales for them just through the fact that a lot of people looking for replacement windows are not aware of Fibrex, and Renewal. We took the material down.

We wanted to explain this history to demonstrate we are in no way biased against this product, and in fact went out of our way to make active consumers aware of it. We have never understood why a business would take this approach, nor do we understand why posters from Renewal make statements such as yours after we extended such a courtesy.

WinBoard Admin's


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 Post subject: Mr. Goodshep
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:10 pm 

Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:04 pm
Posts: 1
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Goodshep, I have some information for you regarding Renewal by Andersen. If your interested let me know. Actually you really might not want to read it though. Renewal by Andersen an overpriced hunk of junk!
LMK


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:57 am 
Site Admin

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 9:11 am
Posts: 96
Offline
Windowmaven,

Please refrain from making blanket statements criticizing products. If you have a specific example of an occurrence, or technical information, then by all means share.

However, we ask that generalized negative comments, (i.e. product bashing) not be used on this board.

Thank you

VRW Admin


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