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 Post subject: help with consendation
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:06 pm 

Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:15 am
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What can be done to the window to decrease consendation on the bottom interior of the sashes? I bought new vinyl windows and after they were installed I noticed the insulating material was just barely covering the top of the sashes (lock side) and consendation was forming around these areas. It is my opinion that the cold air is seeping in through that is causing this consendation. My neighbors all have vinyl windows and they have no issues with consendation. The mfg. claims there is nothing wrong, that this is normal. Will adding foam inside the sashes help (they were suppose to be foam filled but are not). Will adding more weather stripping to the top of the sash help?


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:11 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:21 pm
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Location: DC Metropolitan Area-Maryland/Virginia/DC
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What manufacturer of window?

Adding more weatherstripping is an option but it will eventually break down if it is the foam type.


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:55 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:58 pm
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Location: Northern & Central Illinois, Chicago suburbs
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This time of year there is probably nothing wrong with your windows. If the problem moisture is still there after taking the proper steps to lower the humidity in the home, then you may or may not have a problem with the windows. More times than not it is not the windows. A question... when you look out the window in the morning and see dew all over your new car, do you call the auto dealership? Of course not. Keep that line of thought in your mind as you learn the scientific cause and cure of window condensation.

Your home is saturated with moisture from summer and fall's rain and humidity. Your drywall, your carpet, your furniture, etc. are all full of moisture. As the home drys out with winter's lower humidity levels, everything will begin to dry out. Your old windows that leaked horribly let the interior condensation out through the leaky cracks so sometimes there is more condensation after energy efficient airtight windows are installed than with the old ones. Your new windows help make the home tight which can lead to even more of a buildup of moisture at this time of year. Venting the moisture out of the home, making sure the windows are not tightly covered with drapes and turning off the home's humidifier will all help control the condensation.

Watch this video for a another version of the explanation:
http://www.windowanddoor.com/news-item/companies/new-video-explains-window-condensation


Last edited by Window4U (IL) on Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:00 pm 

Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:15 am
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I am thinking of using the fin type weatherstriping. The manufacture is American Window and Glass out of Evansville, Ind. I bought these because of the outside design and color and supposedly good quailty. Found that the foam filled frames and sashes were not really filled but only partial or not at all (mfg. rep. said this was normal when filling the frames). Just the corners where the mounting holes were. Some other issues. Discovered quality control from this company does not exist. Some installers told me later they were of very poor quality.


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:16 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:14 pm
Posts: 1803
Location: Milwaukee, Madison areas
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1. Multiple things contribute to condensation: including the quality and installation of the window, in addition to the relative humidity inside the home. Any or all of those three things could vary from your neighbors' homes. Window4U's post/link do a good job of explaining the RH part.
2. How do you propose to add foam inside the sashes? That sounds like a terrible idea. For one, it would certainly void your warranty, and beside that, the foam-filling while having some effect, is rather small. It is more of a sales tool (when it is really pushed) than something that has a profound effect on performance. You mention fin-seal, but again, I really don't see how you would accomplish that with any decent fit and finish or reliability.
3. Have you had them out to look at the windows to verify that no weatherstripping is missing, or did they just blow you off when you mentioned condensation?..... Were these professionally installed?


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:50 pm 

Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:15 am
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Yes, I have had the mfg. rep. come out and check these windows. Your right, he just blew me off. My biggest concern was these windows was suppose to be foam filled but I discovered that only a couple sides of the frame (total 7 windows) were and the rest were only partially filled or didn't contain any foam. His explaination was air pockets could form during the filling process. I was told when I purchased these that for them to meet the spects for the government rebates, they had to be foam filled. I think it is interesting to note where the mounting holes were, you could see the foam. How is it that these companies get away with these selling practices?


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:00 pm 

Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 5:52 pm
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Location: SE PA & NJ; CT
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Most vinyl windows qualify with out foam.
Foamed in place/injected foam in the extrusion can, will, and does have voids.
Inserted or a coextruded core will be more reliable for foam filling.
Foam filling is of small importance to the window design, but still nice to have.


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:31 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:14 pm
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Location: Milwaukee, Madison areas
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anthony wrote:
Most vinyl windows qualify with out foam.
Foamed in place/injected foam in the extrusion can, will, and does have voids.
Inserted or a coextruded core will be more reliable for foam filling.
Foam filling is of small importance to the window design, but still nice to have.

Could not have said it any better. :D


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 6:58 am 

Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 5:28 pm
Posts: 211
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In this case, I seriously doubt the non-existence of foam is your issue. It's more likely the installer bowed the frame slightly and you are getting some air leakage.


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 Post subject: Re: help with consendation
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:05 am 

Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 809
Location: Texas - Houston & Austin
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I agree with EcoStar, because of where the condensation is forming. The installers could have bowed the window, or it could have been bowed by the manufacturer. Poor weatherstripping at the meeting rail can also allow infiltration/exfiltration.


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