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 Post subject: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:41 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:34 pm
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I'm a first time home buyer who just bought a house and this winter I'm freezing next to my single pane wood windows. I need to get this fixed so I'm shopping a variety of entry level windows. I realize these aren't for everyone but I just can't afford an anderson or marvin level window. I had them quoted and :shock: Anderson wanted 75k for a full replacement and Marvin not too far behind.

I've quoted the Simonton 5050 and the Vista Panorama.

I like my Simonton installer much better, but his price is about 5% higher than the Vista Panorama. He included capping/existing sill repair in his price.

The Vista installer isn't as responsive or helpful, but I think I like the window better and it's less expensive. Capping included in price, but charges $60 a sill to repair existing rot so has the potential to even out compared to the 5050 quote.

From my research here I've found the Soft Lite Barrington and will be quoting that soon. Should I expect the Barrington to be lower than the 5050?

Assuming similar pricing, what is the recommended choice here? I'm in Georgia. All windows would be double hung, double pane, Low E Argon filled.

Thanks a ton!


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:25 pm 
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5050 is as entry as it gets inside the Simonton line.

If you really like the guy, can you get him to quote you on the 5500?

Still not my favorite window of the options out there, but a better option.

Have the Soft-Lite installer quote you on the Imperial LS.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:37 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:34 pm
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He quoted the 5500 at $50 more per window.

The real question here is how good is the Vista window? It has the hidden balance cover, smaller frame, higher quality screen, etc.. the features add up. And the same Glass Low E Argon filled. Does anyone know if the Vista has drip holes or if it is fully sealed?

I'll have the soft lite dealer quote the recommended Imperial as well, but I'm really on a budget here so every little add on is taken into account.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:49 am 
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Location: Delaware, New Jersey, Philadephia Area
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The last time I sold and installed a Vista Panorama double-hung was back in 2008. I know that they have changed the locks since then and added some glazing options in regards to their spacer. I would never recommend their sliders as they leak air something terrible. Their DH's do feature an irrigation sill and weep system and it's not stepped like that of the Simonton 5500 sill. It's pretty basic and at least not some whacky clip/snap in horrible design like some low-end builder's grade weeped sills. I still wouldn't want to own a window like that.

My rep with Vista left the company and when we picked up several other windows like the Thermal Energex and OKNA 400 series for more budget prioritized projects, it left the every increasing in price Vista lines with no place for me to keep them. Vista has been a nightmare to deal with regarding any warranty issues since I'm not an active dealer these days. Thank God their white basic DH units seem to have held up well.

I think that anything from SL would be a better option if you can afford it. I don't know if OKNA is available in your area but the 400 series would be worth looking at.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:29 pm 
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Location: Milwaukee, Madison areas
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Excellent insight from DM. I happen to agree, there is not much to like about Vista IMO.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 2:41 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:34 pm
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What is the consensus on capping? I have one installer telling me to avoid it and repair the wood with PVC and another installer recommending it. A google search tells a conflicting story as well.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 3:22 pm 
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Location: Milwaukee, Madison areas
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Capping is pretty standard procedure for most installs. No real downside unless it is not done properly, or the look does not go well with your home. Post some pics of the outside of your home when you get a chance... For instance, I'm not a fan of wrapping over cedar boards. Not much technically wrong with it, I just don't like the look. Wood brickmold otoh, allday everyday.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:02 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:34 pm
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This is the house. We are considering doing no grids on the bottom and either 4 or 9 panel grids on the top, half screens on the bottom. The back of the house we are going no grids at all since we look over a private wooded lot.

Any suggestions are welcomed. Most of the salespeople really just leave it up to the customer. I'm open to anything really. At first we thought no grids at all but I think now after looking at architecture that the house is traditional and calls for grids at least on the tops of the double hungs.

I have an Onka and Soft Lite quote coming over the next few days! Thanks for the suggestions so far.


Image

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 11:15 pm 
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Location: DC Metropolitan Area-Maryland/Virginia/DC
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Lovely home.

Keep us posted on your progress.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 9:46 am 

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:34 pm
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I just had the Okna guy come through and he said he won't sell the 400 series only the 500. 500 is 615 per window. Which is a budget buster for us. I can get the 5050 for basically half that. I know it is not even close to quality but our budget here is priority. It is difficult to find anyone in the area who sells Okna and their website isn't much help finding them either.

Any suggestions? Did I just not find the right installer/company? I really like the idea of the 400 series but if I can't find anyone to sell them to me I'll have to make another choice.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:05 am 
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The reality is that the price delta, materials wise, between the 400 and 500 isn't that much and certainly not at the level that would get you to the 5050 pricing that you have.

The 500 does have the exterior accessory groove which will be critical for capping in this case.

If you budget number is down in the low 300's, I don't know how any window can match that to be honest.

From the pictures, the house doesn't look like it calls for a $300'ish window, but I understand that budgets are what they are. Keep in mind, the worst money spent, is money that you spend and are either not happy with or have to spend again.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:37 pm 
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Location: Milwaukee, Madison areas
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Few observations:

1) I'd keep the capping to a minimum. Just around the immediate perimeter to seal and provide a "finished" look. I would not wrap the flat trim material

2) That is a heckuva starter home. Well done! Really a nice looking home.

3) As WoW kind of alluded to, this doesn't look like a home that you want to stick economy grade windows in. You are obviously pretty smart with your money given the home, sticking cheapo windows in there, however, would not be consistent with that. Not suggesting that you should be ripped off to the tune of $1200 per window for a mediocre vinyl window, or even that a $2000 Marvin wood window is necessary, but $600 per for a top performer sounds like the porridge that is just right. $300 installed for any window is a major red flag, not a sustainable business model. For reference, there was an article published going on probably close to 7 or 8 years ago where even a company like Window World had an average per window price of around $400 at that time. Today, your economy grade stuff probably starts closer to $500 from a reputable company that will be around to service it, and make no mistake, you will need service on cheap windows.

Ultimately, regardless of the window you choose, I'd probably hold off for a bit or look into financing if you don't currently have the budget for a good window. Just my $.02


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:32 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:11 am
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the 5500 would not be a bad option at $50 per for upgrade.
The Simonton quote does seem to low to do a proper job and make money, I would proceed with caution going that route.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:47 am 

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:34 pm
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Thanks for the compliments on the house. We bought it 6 months ago knowing it had a lot of work to be put into it. That's the only way we could afford it quite frankly.

We have a few neighbors who have used the company that quoted the 5050 for us. His prices are 325 installed for the smaller double hung windows 365 for the larger double hungs (includes sill/nose repair and alum wrapping). Since he did my neighbors house and they were very happy with him I def feel comfortable using him to purchase through and install.

I'll let you know what the route we decide to go. I'm still torn on a few things but have to make a decision to to some water intrusion on our large family room picture window and a few of the double hungs.


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 Post subject: Re: Simonton 5050 vs Vista Panorama vs Soft Lite Barrington
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:35 pm 

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:20 pm
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I could pull any guy off the street that can operate a cordless drill to install some windows, and the average person that doesn't know what they are looking at will think they are fine. That is until they are leaking air or water, or parts break and the guy is nowhere to be found in a few years to replace them. Even a quality guy that does side jobs will be higher than that. You said yourself that you have water intrusion issues on a few windows currently, no better way to make that happen on all your windows than to get new ones installed for $300 a pop. Really not wise


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