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 Post subject: Which install method is better jump frame or pull frame?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:06 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 1:31 am
Posts: 3
Location: Modesto CA
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I have old single pane windows with small aluminum frames. 2 of the bidders said they would with a a special tool pull the frame out w/o disturbing the facade and replace the window that way.

Another installer said that he would recommend against that method because you have much more chance of disturbing the vapor barrier, so he would jump the exisiting rail. He also said that in the bay area of calif building codes do not allow for a pull frame method, only a complete tear out or jump. BTW these windows are the Simonton 7300.

Does anyone on this board have strong opinions on 1 method over the other. I can not afford a complete tear out and replacement because I have plaster on the outside of the house.

Thanks for any opinions.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:18 pm 

Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:55 am
Posts: 12
Location: Ohio
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If you keep the old frame in then you will have to have a smaller window to put back in.
Also by keeping the old frame in it will be harder to cover the frame and there is also a risk of leaking.

In the north we remove all the frame from Alum windows because of condensation.

If there a good installer the old window can be removed without destroying the outside casings or plaster.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:35 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:21 pm
Posts: 3513
Location: DC Metropolitan Area-Maryland/Virginia/DC
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We remove them as well.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 7:21 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 1:31 am
Posts: 3
Location: Modesto CA
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Windows on Washington wrote:
We remove them as well.


I just spoke to a Simonton rep a few hours ago and he said that the pull frame method is actually not approved by the name of the group that oversees window manufacturers. The only two approved methods which is what Simonton recommends is to do a complete tear out, or jump the existing frame. He did add however that some installers are comfortable with the pull frame method and do a good job, but it is not an approved method and therefore leakage would not be warranted by Simonton.

So I guess I don't have much choice but to go with the guy that jumps the frame.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:55 pm 

Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:55 am
Posts: 12
Location: Ohio
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It really depends on what type of window it is.
If its a replacement window pull the frames
If its a a flush fin mount type window then you keep the old frame in.

I am a Installation Masters Trainer and they really are very careful with watching out that you restore weather barriers.

Good luck with your job. :wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:10 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 10:15 pm
Posts: 16
Location: SF Bay Area
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Doing a retro-fit window leave the frame in, Once you remove it, it will start to leak. I have seen it take 3 or 4 years to start to come thru so you can see the signs. Stucco is only as water tight as the paint is.
If you still cant decide go to the building department and talk with them.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 1:23 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 1:31 am
Posts: 3
Location: Modesto CA
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Thanks for your help everyone. I decided to go with the vendor that is going to jump the frame. The Simonton rep also told me that plaster is quite porous and water barriers are very important to not be disturbed, and as windowman said sometimes damage will not show up for years. Leaving the existing frame sounds like the best method of protecting the water barrier.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 10:32 pm 

Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2005 3:57 pm
Posts: 66
Location: West Coast
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Many cities in teh California have you pull a permit to do work with the pull frame method. So many contractors us teh jump method. It is preferred to leave the frame in my all companies selling windows in the Republic of California :lol:


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